tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-26974492.post3178442180410756875..comments2024-03-28T18:54:13.800-04:00Comments on alien romances: Why Do "They" Despise Romance?Rowena Cherryhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11839386556697211986noreply@blogger.comBlogger15125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-26974492.post-42400925436137848672010-08-03T16:03:16.373-04:002010-08-03T16:03:16.373-04:00Here's another "Beat Sheet" to use t...Here's another "Beat Sheet" to use to double-check your finished product. <br /><br />http://thescriptlab.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=710:despicable-me-sequences&catid=129:sequence-breakdowns&Itemid=150<br /><br />Once you get the hang of "beats" you will see them in every piece of fiction. <br /><br />See my current 7 part series on EDITING for what editors look for, and try to "correct" your MS to with their editorial rewrite orders and why they do it that way.<br /><br />http://aliendjinnromances.blogspot.com/2010/08/what-exactly-is-editing-part-i.html<br /><br />By the 7th entry in this series, you should be able to tell whether you are an editor or a writer. You might be surprised.<br /><br />Jacqueline Lichtenberg<br />http://jacquelinelichtenberg.comJacqueline Lichtenberghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01613040740264804278noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-26974492.post-32171098986004449912010-07-20T19:06:36.841-04:002010-07-20T19:06:36.841-04:00Heather:
You've got a point about Agents.
Th...Heather:<br /><br />You've got a point about Agents.<br /><br />The Agent who wanted the worldbuilding altered no doubt knew her editor clients to a T and knew exactly what product to feed them.<br /><br />The writer had a choice - make the changes, show the agent something else tamer, keep agent shopping. <br /><br />It's a Hobson's Choice when you're trying to make a living at writing rather than just expressing yourself. <br /><br />Jacqueline Lichtenberg<br />http://jacquelinelichtenberg.comJacqueline Lichtenberghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01613040740264804278noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-26974492.post-35186023576829860892010-06-06T22:15:59.411-04:002010-06-06T22:15:59.411-04:00Thanks again for such an informative post, Jacquel...Thanks again for such an informative post, Jacqueline. Naturally, I have plans for it *rubs hands together excitedly*.<br /><br />Francine, I think romance <i>can</i> generate serious conflict, but it doesn't necessarily mean that authors are taking advantage of such conflict to the full extent possible. <br /><br />Case in point: today I <a href="http://www.smartbitchestrashybooks.com/index.php/weblog/comments/ripple-iron-on-the-stations/" rel="nofollow">read about</a> an author (in the comment section) who shared that a prospective agent told her to change a number of worldbuilding details in her story (the romance was set in Australia) or the agent wouldn't consider it. According to the agent, readers want their romances to be "safe." <br /><br />That mindset may be prevalent in the romance industry, which could account for the lack of intense conflict in many romances, but it doesn't represent all readers and authors. I like to think science fiction romance is one subgenre that can shake things up a bit. Okay, a lot!<br /><br />Luckily, with romance so vast, there is something for everyone. I'm all for readers who want "safe" romances to have them, as long as I can have my "unsafe" ones, LOL!Heather Masseyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00913459109753829391noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-26974492.post-21581293664776176242010-06-02T16:20:05.649-04:002010-06-02T16:20:05.649-04:00KimberAn
Oh, yes, the ergonomic typing posture is...KimberAn<br /><br />Oh, yes, the ergonomic typing posture is extremely idiosyncratic. <br /><br />JLJacqueline Lichtenberghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01613040740264804278noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-26974492.post-41815087478837530642010-06-02T14:59:39.098-04:002010-06-02T14:59:39.098-04:00Will do, Jacqueline.
Never thought of my hands hu...Will do, Jacqueline.<br /><br />Never thought of my hands hurting because I'm overcompensating for my back. I used to have back trouble. Interesting how it went away and now my hands hurt. Will look into it and the chiropractor. I need to learn the posture/position which works best for my own body, I reckon.Kimber Lihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03982239712083114488noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-26974492.post-70755974264784671502010-06-02T13:37:17.495-04:002010-06-02T13:37:17.495-04:00Kmber An
Did I mention - I like your theme analysi...Kmber An<br />Did I mention - I like your theme analysis. Would definitely read that book. Keep me posted.<br /><br />Jacqueline Lichtenberg<br />http://www.simegen.com/jl/Jacqueline Lichtenberghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01613040740264804278noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-26974492.post-52551939166946472812010-06-02T13:12:57.590-04:002010-06-02T13:12:57.590-04:00KimberAn
If you mean tendonitis from keyboarding -...KimberAn<br />If you mean tendonitis from keyboarding - of course it's ergonomics of typing position.<br /><br />But I've found that emotional TENSION level (i.e. adrenalin) drives the condition. <br /><br />That's why I assign so many drills and exercises. <br /><br />Drive the techniques into the subconscious so you do them without thinking and with nonchalant confidence, without any effort or self-doubt, then use a chair and table position that doesn't strain the arms -- and change position often -- and do your BACK EXERCISES -- and you don't get tendonitis from writing novels. <br /><br />I have said often (because I've learned from friends experiences) that not only is writing a performing art - it is an ATHLETIC occupation. <br /><br />It puts the most strain on the back.<br /><br />I know a large number of writers who dropped out of the profession because of back trouble. And "guarding" the back with muscular tension will throw the arm positions off and trigger that whole painful syndrome. <br /><br />Most prolific writers know a good chiropractor. <br /><br />Jacqueline Lichtenberg<br />http://www.simegen.com/jl/Jacqueline Lichtenberghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01613040740264804278noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-26974492.post-33304992452589447542010-06-02T08:19:02.296-04:002010-06-02T08:19:02.296-04:00Very educational post. Thank you!
I think I'...Very educational post. Thank you!<br /><br />I think I've done all that with SUGAR RUSH. Now, I just have to wait and see if I did it well enough. Four requests for Fulls and two Partials so far.<br /><br />And one wicked case of Tendonitis. Got any advice on that?<br /><br />The Theme going in was 'Achieving the Freedom to Live.' It quickly turned into 'What is courage?' and 'What is Loyalty?'<br /><br />Answer: Love. Love is the root of Courage. And Loyalty without Love is Fear.<br /><br />It's been quite a journey! Thanks for all your help through this blog and Editing Circle.Kimber Lihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03982239712083114488noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-26974492.post-86789168002166067872010-06-01T20:20:14.172-04:002010-06-01T20:20:14.172-04:00Very true. Comedy is like an entirely different wo...Very true. Comedy is like an entirely different world. Be fun to discuss it though.PennyAshhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16475626029423374076noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-26974492.post-72624658180317367082010-06-01T19:28:21.053-04:002010-06-01T19:28:21.053-04:00Penny:
Thank you for the long and interesting comm...Penny:<br />Thank you for the long and interesting comment. <br /><br />There is as you point out, so very much more to be said on Romance subgenres -- but just narrowing it down to the RomCom doesn't help much because COMEDY itself is a huge field, even bigger maybe than SF/F! <br /><br />Jacqueline Lichtenberg<br />http://jacquelinelichtenberg.comJacqueline Lichtenberghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01613040740264804278noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-26974492.post-1091627910866525592010-06-01T18:51:51.025-04:002010-06-01T18:51:51.025-04:00I write romance in various sub-genres. I also used...I write romance in various sub-genres. I also used to edit for several publishers. The story is always the romance between two characters who fall in love after they meet. The plot on the other hand can be anything from alien abductions complete with ufos, government conspiracies, and hybrid children, to a serial killer stalking a couple across New Mexico. I have to disagree with Francine up to a point. You can have serious conflict focused simply in the romance itself. Inter racial romances do this all the time.<br /><br />If you're a writer you are a story teller. Book, film, TV are all simply the medium the story is delivered in. The key is to know your audience and give them what they want. In romance your audience expects certain things. She's almost always looking for a few hours of escape into a fantasy world that is as far from her real life as possible. She wants the Knight-In-Shining-Armor to come sweep her off her feet. She wants the gorgeous hero with all the trimmings. The excitement of the setting, whether it's a space station in a degraded orbit about to be destroyed as it enters the atmosphere or the enemy army aout to find the resistance cell, is the icing on the cake. <br /><br />As for the were-jaguars, sounds like what Francine picked up is what they're calling erotic romance these days. The focus is the sexual relationship between the characters. In these books the sex is the story, everything else is window dressing.<br /><br />And yes there are specific formulas romance follows. I think this is why so many people despise and look down on romance. They think it is a simple thing to write within a strict, yet vague set of rules. Just plug in a hero and heroine and go. Trust me it isn't that easy. <br /><br />As far as romcom is concerned, comedy is very subjective. Cutesy almost never pulls me in, book or movie. Slapstick on the other hand, if you can pull it off the way the Three Stooges did or Carol Burnett in her early days, then you've got me. And I love a good spoof, but Lord save me from cheesy too cute done to death openings. I think humor should lay in the reactions of an ordinary person to extraordinary circumstances. By the way commercials manage to pull this off regularly without being saccharine or cute.<br /><br />I think it is the kiss of death to insult the intelligence of your audience. You can be funny without being insulting. You want to have your audience empathising with the main character even if it's a subconscious thing.<br /><br />Fiction Delivery System, I like it. Got into this a bit #scriptchat before last when they were talking about the difference between novels and scripts. I maintain the only real difference is in format. Both types of writer are still telling a story they're just doing it within the framework of their chosen delivery method.PennyAshhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16475626029423374076noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-26974492.post-72346294187799730982010-06-01T16:12:30.328-04:002010-06-01T16:12:30.328-04:00Francine:
You're right about the conflict-gen...Francine:<br /><br />You're right about the conflict-generator in a Romance-driven plot. The only way to take the inner-angst seriously is to eliminate all external problems. (keep it in the bedroom not the boardroom)<br /><br />I treat the print and video media identically because I'm working on my own theory of what fiction is and why it's valuable.<br /><br />I call it the Fiction Delivery System - it's what's delivered that's important, not the mechanism. And I've read some pretty good print romcoms with and without vampires! <br /><br />As for "they" -- Romance readers and writers "hear" a steady roar of undifferentiated voices sneering at their most treasured pleasure. The sneer is everywhere, and it bewilders and disaffects the dedicated Romance fan. <br /><br />As a professional reviewer, I read a lot of the type of novel you picked up at the airport. The cost is why the ipad reads Kindle books now! You can read Kindle on your Blackberry - pretty soon most devices, too.<br /><br />I should discuss many of the points you've made in long, involved posts full of links. We'll see if I can get around to organizing that, but someone on Twitter asked for pointers on doing complex edits quickly, and I need to figure out how to explain that first.<br /><br />Jacqueline Lichtenberg<br />http://jacquelinelichtenberg<br /><br />ps: Thanks for noting that you had read the Sime~Gen novels!Jacqueline Lichtenberghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01613040740264804278noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-26974492.post-49623974067114580122010-06-01T15:25:17.549-04:002010-06-01T15:25:17.549-04:00I have to admit a real liking for the romcom subge...I have to admit a real liking for the romcom subgenre as a whole -- I find it very entertaining, as I do most types of movies.<br /><br />Having said that, the formula for the genre often contains certain elements, and the one I frequently have to ignore is the "meet cute," in which our characters meet for the first time, usually either by screaming at each other or bumping into each other.<br /><br />Some movies ("Sleepless," "You've Got Mail") bypass the meet cute entirely.<br /><br />Others (most Hugh Grant films) handle it abominably. Some put a nice twist on it.<br /><br />Most, however, do not handle it well, with intelligence-insulting or merely moronic situations that I sometimes find it hard to get past.<br /><br />My personal favorite "Meet Cute" is from Serendipity. They just meet, and spend a little time together. Then separate.Mark Worthen (nitewanderer)htttp://worthensworlds.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-26974492.post-34792346610310057392010-06-01T14:04:32.164-04:002010-06-01T14:04:32.164-04:00TV loves a good series. Movies love sequels. One...TV loves a good series. Movies love sequels. One of the problems with romance is that it has a limited lifespan. Once you resolve the relationship, it takes a lot of work to keep it going without resorting to splitting up the lovers in a way that unravels and invalidates everything that the previous story <br />had built. I think that is one of the things that can lose romance a lot of respect. In an effort to squeeze more out of the romance, it disrespects itself.<br /><br />I remember watching the sequel to Karate Kid and having a feeling of total contempt toward the romance. Just a short while ago, he was devoted to this other girl and now he's completely forgotten her and he's into this chick. Fortunately for the movie, the romance element wasn't all that important. It was used by the plot, but you always knew that it didn't matter all that much. I don't think the target audience was old enough to care one way or the other. Still, I can't help but feel that the movie lost its integrity by copping out like that.<br /><br />BTW, I'm interested in who "they" are and what you feel indicates that romance is disrespected. Not that I necessarily disagree, but I'm curious...is it because you don't see any "pure" romance movies/series out there? Or something else? And are we talking about respect for written romance, or TV/movie media? I was a little confused about which genre you were referring to.<br /><br />Here's my personal guess as to why romance isn't respected. Being desperately bored in an airport recently, I broke one of my own rules and paid full price for a romance novel. It had were-jaguars so I thought it would be interesting. I paid eight bucks for a book that was barely worth the time it took to read it. Breasts were heaving on just about every other page, I mean, seriously, you'd think they'd get sprained after a while. The paperbook romance market is so large that the market is glutted with bad writing. Recently, there have been a lot of "arcane" romances, with supernatural creatures as romantic partners instead of threat. Editors are allowing really horribly written books through because people will pay good money for the theme, regardless of the quality of the writing. Judging by what's out there and how big the market is, romance readers must not be very discriminating.<br /><br />Of course, there are desperately substandard books written for every genre. There just seem to be a higher percentage of them in romance. And with the sudden popularity of the supernatural romance, this quality control problem is creeping into the genre. Higher demand breeds lower quality. It's just a law <br />of economics.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14973280047043374435noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-26974492.post-72879395917663130922010-06-01T14:02:55.433-04:002010-06-01T14:02:55.433-04:00One of the problems is that by itself, romance isn...One of the problems is that by itself, romance isn't enough to generate a serious conflict. A conflict needs to be deadly serious; giant robots <br />threatening to extinguish life as we know it, terrifying aliens that can creep into your home at night and eat you, killers who know where you live and are <br />determined to wipe out you and your family, a fatal degenerative disease that is turning your brain to mush...<br /><br />It is conflict that drives the story. Next to these sort of world class problems, you try to stack up "I have to endure the presence of this guy whom I am <br />simultaneously repelled by and attracted to" and it is small wonder that "pure" romance isn't taken seriously.<br /><br />Romance is not the story; it's a perfume that the story can wear to enhance itself. It cannot be overpowering, and it must be appropriate, blending with <br />the "scent" of the main story. Love should grow out of the interactions of the individuals as they deal with the conflict. The Sime-Gen books are highly <br />unusual in that the conflict itself is tightly wound up in the relationships between the characters, and those relationships are quite literally a matter of life and death.<br /><br />As a supporting element, romance is an undeniable success. It's in everything. The other day I was persuaded to sit down and watch my seven year old son's favorite movie with him. Transformers. In between giant transforming robots and exploding things and action-packed chase scenes, they made time for a romance. He hated all the "kissing stuff" but he endured it for the good parts. My husband confessed that he didn't even notice *what* the robots were <br />doing when they shared the screen with Megan Fox. Romance is a secondary element in almost everything you watch on the big screen, or the little one. So is <br />comedy. A truly good movie needs a blend of all these elements in order to appeal to everyone.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14973280047043374435noreply@blogger.com